Pontiac Grand Am:

97 grand am cranks won't start

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# 1  2/23/2012 5:36 PM

squirelscat
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Registered: 2/23/2012
Posts: 15

97 grand am cranks won't start

I'm working on a 97 Grand Am. This is similar to other posts with a few differences. It will crank but wont start. It will run on its own after starting on ether. I attempted to test fuel pressure as it doesn't have a port. It blew my gauge of the hose so I assume it has enough initial pressure. I have a Good Code reader it gives only P0113 Intake Air Temperature High Input. The scanner gave a temperature of 56 degrees F which is fairly accurate. It has 5 volts at the sensor as it should. I tried clearing the code and trying again to no change. It has, what I consider to be, excessive noise from the timing cover area and a lot of Air from the oil fill (maybe high blow by as is has moisture from oil in air intake from breather). I have run into similar problems on another Grand Am so I don't know if these issues are just the normal for these. I'm really loosing any remaining respect for these vehicles. The spark plugs could use replacing, worn and at around 65 gap. All cylinders are reading close enough to 200 psi on compression that also seems pretty good. What am I overlooking?

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# 2  2/23/2012 5:59 PM

TechHelp2
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Registered: 11/24/2009
Posts: 1299

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

If it will run on ether then the problem would probably be the fuel system. You would need to know how much fuel pressure is in the system. There is a tool that takes the place of the fuel filter and has a fitting for a fuel tester.

Do you have the 2 second prime when you turn on the key? You should hear the fuel pump run for 2 seconds with the key turned on. If you don't it could be a bad fuel pump, fuel pump solenoid, a blown fuse or a bad PCM.

Using a test light have someone check to see if you have 12 volts at the fuel pump when you turn on the key. You only have 2 seconds so you would need someone to turn on the key while the other checks the voltage at the pump. If you don't have the 12 volts then check the above suggestions. If you do have the 12 volts and the pump runs then check to see if you have proper fuel injector operation.

You can check this by using a noid light plugged into the fuel injector connector. When you crank the engine over the light will flash, if it doesn't then check the crank sensor for proper operation.

Try these suggestion and get back to me with the results, we can go on from there.


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# 3  2/23/2012 9:42 PM

squirelscat
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Registered: 2/23/2012
Posts: 15

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

I was able to place a pressure gauge on the return side of the fuel rail. It was 14-16 psi at least I turned it off before it spit the line off and made a mess. Should I be getting that much on the return?

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# 4  2/23/2012 10:01 PM

TechHelp2
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Registered: 11/24/2009
Posts: 1299

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

The fuel pressure should be about 41 to 47 PSI. Remember the fuel goes through the fuel pressure regulator and what is not used by the fuel injectors goes back to the tank.

I don't think taking a pressure reading at the return line is accurate and is defiantly not safe and is a huge fire hazard.

You need to get an accurate fuel pressure before you can continue diagnostics.

Did you try a fuel pump relay? You can try swapping a relay from another system like the A/C clutch to see if it works.

Do you have a strong spark at the spark plugs? What size engine are we talking about?


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# 5  2/24/2012 12:01 AM

squirelscat
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Registered: 2/23/2012
Posts: 15

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

I was able to rent the proper noid light to test the injector pulse from the PCM from the parts house. They didn't have an adapter for the fuel test. I'm going to need it. I have a manual for an older model but the fuel pressure spec wasn't nearly that high. I think it was 14-16 psi. Anyway the noids weren't lighting indicating no signal at the injectors. Sorry, its the 2.4L. I did replace the plugs, they were in pretty sorry shape. That used to be more of a problem in carburetor models, I've never had that problem with fuel injector but it couldn't hurt. Any more will have to wait til next Tues.

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# 6  2/24/2012 12:07 AM

squirelscat
Member
Registered: 2/23/2012
Posts: 15

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

Do you test both sides or just need the pressure (supply) side.

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# 7  2/24/2012 4:47 AM

TechHelp2
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Registered: 11/24/2009
Posts: 1299

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

If you don't have an injector pulse then you probably don't have spark at the spark plugs.

The most common problem for this type of problem is a bad crank sensor. A quick way to check this is to watch the RPM on your scanner while you crank the engine, you should have an RPM of about 200 to 400 RPM. If you have 0 RPM's then you probably have a bad crank sensor.

Check for spark first before you check the fuel pressure, the way you are explaining the problem it seems to point to a spark problem.

You would check on the pressure side (supply) not the return side of the fuel rail if you need to check the fuel pressure.


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# 8  2/27/2012 5:47 PM

Administrator
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Registered: 9/27/2008
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Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

Yes, there's no such thing as a fuel pressure test on the return side (between the fuel pressure regulator and the tank). You have to tap into the pressure side (between the pump, and before or at the fuel rail).


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# 9  2/28/2012 8:02 PM

squirelscat
Member
Registered: 2/23/2012
Posts: 15

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

I was able to rig a pressure test adapter and it went to 65-70 psi. I was watching the RPM's on the test meter it would just read 90 and 0 RPM's while cranking. The gauge on the dash reads nothing. Would that cause the no start on its own and run fine after starting on ether?

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# 10  2/28/2012 9:18 PM

squirelscat
Member
Registered: 2/23/2012
Posts: 15

Re: 97 grand am cranks won't start

Replaced the crank position sensor. No dice! Rpm's are still not being read on neither the dash gauge or my monitor. No start. Battery cables look fine. Lost!

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